Debra is right, but also we have lots of evidence already, and so can see what is missing, altered etc... Maybe a 'smoking gun' bit of evidence is gone, but there will be other evidence which tells us it exists.
Often as not, it is not the original crime which gets uncovered, it is the cover up which draws the focus and is a crime all by itself.
Ultimately it is in the hands of the public and how they respond. I hope that after electing a crook, twice, that those who erred have finally learned something. I'm not even an American, but this shitshow affects the entire world.
As a life-long Western New Yorker, I can even see the hardcore MAGA pockets HERE evaporating. The Deathcult is FINALLY starting to wake up as it struggles to buy $16 cuts of beef. (No really. We bought a decen-sized roast that was $16 last weekend!)
We have MAGATS around us and they usually live in ramshackle houses surrounded with clutter. Most of them are hard-core losers who have run ins with the law. Humans call them white trash.
A lot of people are slaves to their politics and that’s kind of pathetic but the MAGAT is a slave to pure fascism.
Exactly. I have always wondered what the Repubs would have done had Bill Clinton said yah, cheated on my wife with Monica. Is there anything else you want to know?. The shocking thing was that Clinton was a lawyer who should have said "I do not recall" which worked for SC Justice Kavanaugh who lied his way to confirmation. Lying is okay with Repubs, but not if they can use it agains Dems.
Clinton was charged with lying to congress. But there was no underlying crime, just the denial of an affair. How many men would freely admit to cheating? Embarassing, absolutely,criminal no.
The real point is that congress now uses it routinely as entrapment. It is a political act done only to try to take down those they do not like Bolton, Comey and James.
Point being congress wastes too much time manufacturing fake outrage and conducting hearings to take down the other party. They are now using similar tactics to charge Comey, Bolton and James with lying instead of any crime.
Great point! Scholars and legal experts can look at the evidence and pinpoint what is clearly missing. It's just too bad toddler-a-brained Bunkerboy and it's college dropout flunkies have no way of knowing that.
Doctoring documents has been around since documents (of any nature) have existed, but along with that crime has been an 'arms race' where experts detect the doctoring, and the criminals get better, and the detectives get better... Personally I expect the 'cruel clown car' which is this administration will not be competent at this either.
Yes, of course the criminals will lie. It is by revealing their lies, force them to lie after lie after lie that we peal off the 'loyalists' and defeat them. This is how we "literally get rid of them". There will be democrats in the mix, I am sure, because historically Democrats have usually been the ones caught doing 'sex crimes', but they too should be punished.
My hunch is that Trump did not merely 'taste the product' but was actually a business partner with Epstein in his 'human trafficking' enterprise, through the use of his pageants, resorts, casinos, large plane and large number of apartments in his buildings.
Don't get your hopes up too much. FBI had everything they needed to nail Trump on the documents. See how that turned out. The magic elixir is to find a clueless judge who cannot take the heat and Trump will skate. Even with a so so case, the appeal process is so slow, T will be long gone if there is any charge. I have very little faith that justice whatever that means will prevail.
What innocent people, the billionaires who don't want you know? Trust us we know. Would have been cheaper and in your best interest to just pay your fair share of taxes.
That's what I have been confused about since I became interested in politics in 2016! (I had always voted, but was never very into it.) The wealth tax suggested by Americans is a mere THREE PERCENT I believe!!! TOPS!!! How will that affect criminals raking in BILLIONS? (If one accumulates $1,000,000,000, one broke the law.)
FBI could not nail Al Capone for his crimes, so they nailed him with tax evasion. However since the IRS has never finished (nor started) "auditing" Trumps taxes, I have little hope he will be so charged. One can always hope though.
But this is not just about billionaires paying their taxes. The moral rights of female children have been violated and those who are associated in any way with those violations need to pay for their crimes.
Actually it would be wonderful if the good that could come out of this travesty could be an entire rethinking of what the States wants to be. Maybe a country with true moral fiber (not the hypocritical Sunday for an hour so-called Christian kind of spineless toadyism)? Maybe a country that glorifies peace instead of glorifying war? Maybe a country with true participatory democracy instead of one with an "Electoral College"? Maybe a country where the almighty dollar cannot buy elections? One in which power is NOT defined as power OVER?
But I am not an American and do not live in America, so I cannot be part of the solution. Americans did not listen to us when we warned you. I can only hope that what Americans have allowed to happen to their country, so openly and so blatantly, will never ever again be allowed BY them to happen to them again. Surely some good can come out of this if Americans stop, essentially, being so, well, "American".
Sorry if I have insulted you, but that's the way it looks from here. Regardless of what my perceptions and observations are, you, ultimately, will decide your own fates.
The release of the Epstein files is needed precisely because lots of powerful and rich people were involved and so were protected either politically or because prosecutors hate cases against rich and powerful because all those expensive lawyers and their endless delay tactics and 'trying the case in the media' (which prosecutors are blocked from doing) and everything else about the situation makes them incredibly hard to get a conviction, and then because the person with the richest lawyers has never been convicted before, they get a slap on the wrist, no jail time, or if they do see the jail, it is with perks and treatment that make you not see it as a jail at all. So they go after the small fry and move on to more 'gettable' bad guys.
With the release the rich and powerful become exposed. It is precisely because they are being 'tried by the media' and having to defend themselves faced with evidence, that they become vulnerable.
I do hope they will be able to get the FULL reports with ONLY the victims names redacted, despite the clear intent of the administration. Also, the house committee should continue to get stuff from the Epstein estate, and push to get stuff from the treasury and other relevant departments.
Crowdsourcing the investigation into the mountain of evidence will certainly uncover lots of crimes.
We start off knowing there were LOTS of major crimes. It is essentially certain Epstein and Maxwell were guilty. It is by the very nature of their guilt that we KNOW there were LOTS of other people who partook of the forbidden fruit, abusing those children. It is by the nature of the business model of Epstein's enterprise that we KNOW the bulk of those predators were rich and powerful.
So, if the files do NOT produce the evidence we KNOW must exist, including evidence we have already seen, that we will know there is still an ongoing coverup.
True, but even rich people can find themselves unhappy to admit they are pedophiles, which is what accepting a pardon would do. Then there are the state crimes...
Not everyone wants to associate or do business with an admitted pedophile.
This is about power and greed, as I am sure you know. Preaching to the choir. The choreography of the files is for voter morale. The immorality runs deep.
My concern is that trump only started supporting the Epstein files release because he has 2 different ways to avoid releasing them. But he is definitely basking in the glory for releasing them.
This is going to be the problem with AI. If you can fake everything, evidence as we once knew it like eye witness and document files become meaningless. So we will now have to have 2 trials. One to validate evidence and the other for the real trial. As if our court system were not slow enough now. Perhaps we can then have AI justice to speed up the process.
I'm not getting "terrified". I'm sensing they are sick of this shit, ready to move on, anxious like soldiers with no battle to fight at the moment. But terrified, not really. I think they sense that Trump is no chump--he couldn't go from an all-out war to prevent the release to "Eh that's fine, go for it"--that he must have a few tricks up his sleeve. He always does....
Don't you suspect that the files could have been altered ? They had them all this time. How do we know that the files were not edited?
Debra is right, but also we have lots of evidence already, and so can see what is missing, altered etc... Maybe a 'smoking gun' bit of evidence is gone, but there will be other evidence which tells us it exists.
Often as not, it is not the original crime which gets uncovered, it is the cover up which draws the focus and is a crime all by itself.
Ultimately it is in the hands of the public and how they respond. I hope that after electing a crook, twice, that those who erred have finally learned something. I'm not even an American, but this shitshow affects the entire world.
I totally agree. It's so much more than trump.
As a life-long Western New Yorker, I can even see the hardcore MAGA pockets HERE evaporating. The Deathcult is FINALLY starting to wake up as it struggles to buy $16 cuts of beef. (No really. We bought a decen-sized roast that was $16 last weekend!)
We have MAGATS around us and they usually live in ramshackle houses surrounded with clutter. Most of them are hard-core losers who have run ins with the law. Humans call them white trash.
A lot of people are slaves to their politics and that’s kind of pathetic but the MAGAT is a slave to pure fascism.
Exactly. I have always wondered what the Repubs would have done had Bill Clinton said yah, cheated on my wife with Monica. Is there anything else you want to know?. The shocking thing was that Clinton was a lawyer who should have said "I do not recall" which worked for SC Justice Kavanaugh who lied his way to confirmation. Lying is okay with Repubs, but not if they can use it agains Dems.
Clinton was charged with lying to congress. But there was no underlying crime, just the denial of an affair. How many men would freely admit to cheating? Embarassing, absolutely,criminal no.
The real point is that congress now uses it routinely as entrapment. It is a political act done only to try to take down those they do not like Bolton, Comey and James.
Point being congress wastes too much time manufacturing fake outrage and conducting hearings to take down the other party. They are now using similar tactics to charge Comey, Bolton and James with lying instead of any crime.
Great point! Scholars and legal experts can look at the evidence and pinpoint what is clearly missing. It's just too bad toddler-a-brained Bunkerboy and it's college dropout flunkies have no way of knowing that.
It’s very difficult to “doctor” files! We need to make sure that forensic specialists view those documents.
It's very easy to doctor digital documents.
Crooks and their accomplices do crooked things.
Doctoring documents has been around since documents (of any nature) have existed, but along with that crime has been an 'arms race' where experts detect the doctoring, and the criminals get better, and the detectives get better... Personally I expect the 'cruel clown car' which is this administration will not be competent at this either.
They'll try, and if found out, they'll just claim political fake news. The only way to get rid of them is to literally get rid of them!
Yes, of course the criminals will lie. It is by revealing their lies, force them to lie after lie after lie that we peal off the 'loyalists' and defeat them. This is how we "literally get rid of them". There will be democrats in the mix, I am sure, because historically Democrats have usually been the ones caught doing 'sex crimes', but they too should be punished.
My hunch is that Trump did not merely 'taste the product' but was actually a business partner with Epstein in his 'human trafficking' enterprise, through the use of his pageants, resorts, casinos, large plane and large number of apartments in his buildings.
I agree, and I believe all the women who have accused him.
Okay maybe some dirt comes up. Who exactly is going to prosecute when T runs DOJ and congress?
Sure, but reputations matter. Elections matter. The Truth is Trump's enemy.
Don't get your hopes up too much. FBI had everything they needed to nail Trump on the documents. See how that turned out. The magic elixir is to find a clueless judge who cannot take the heat and Trump will skate. Even with a so so case, the appeal process is so slow, T will be long gone if there is any charge. I have very little faith that justice whatever that means will prevail.
I just hate the thought of him getting off on this, given everything else he has already done to this country.
What innocent people, the billionaires who don't want you know? Trust us we know. Would have been cheaper and in your best interest to just pay your fair share of taxes.
That's what I have been confused about since I became interested in politics in 2016! (I had always voted, but was never very into it.) The wealth tax suggested by Americans is a mere THREE PERCENT I believe!!! TOPS!!! How will that affect criminals raking in BILLIONS? (If one accumulates $1,000,000,000, one broke the law.)
FBI could not nail Al Capone for his crimes, so they nailed him with tax evasion. However since the IRS has never finished (nor started) "auditing" Trumps taxes, I have little hope he will be so charged. One can always hope though.
But this is not just about billionaires paying their taxes. The moral rights of female children have been violated and those who are associated in any way with those violations need to pay for their crimes.
Actually it would be wonderful if the good that could come out of this travesty could be an entire rethinking of what the States wants to be. Maybe a country with true moral fiber (not the hypocritical Sunday for an hour so-called Christian kind of spineless toadyism)? Maybe a country that glorifies peace instead of glorifying war? Maybe a country with true participatory democracy instead of one with an "Electoral College"? Maybe a country where the almighty dollar cannot buy elections? One in which power is NOT defined as power OVER?
But I am not an American and do not live in America, so I cannot be part of the solution. Americans did not listen to us when we warned you. I can only hope that what Americans have allowed to happen to their country, so openly and so blatantly, will never ever again be allowed BY them to happen to them again. Surely some good can come out of this if Americans stop, essentially, being so, well, "American".
Sorry if I have insulted you, but that's the way it looks from here. Regardless of what my perceptions and observations are, you, ultimately, will decide your own fates.
Don't dismiss the value of one hour Sunday prayer service. That is the one hour Republicans are not preying on the rest of us.
EXCELLENT play on words, Russ! Thank you for the touch of humour. 😵💫🤗
The files have probably already been scrubbed. That's why the Senate chief unanimously. They knew everyone would be redacted.
The release of the Epstein files is needed precisely because lots of powerful and rich people were involved and so were protected either politically or because prosecutors hate cases against rich and powerful because all those expensive lawyers and their endless delay tactics and 'trying the case in the media' (which prosecutors are blocked from doing) and everything else about the situation makes them incredibly hard to get a conviction, and then because the person with the richest lawyers has never been convicted before, they get a slap on the wrist, no jail time, or if they do see the jail, it is with perks and treatment that make you not see it as a jail at all. So they go after the small fry and move on to more 'gettable' bad guys.
With the release the rich and powerful become exposed. It is precisely because they are being 'tried by the media' and having to defend themselves faced with evidence, that they become vulnerable.
I do hope they will be able to get the FULL reports with ONLY the victims names redacted, despite the clear intent of the administration. Also, the house committee should continue to get stuff from the Epstein estate, and push to get stuff from the treasury and other relevant departments.
Crowdsourcing the investigation into the mountain of evidence will certainly uncover lots of crimes.
We start off knowing there were LOTS of major crimes. It is essentially certain Epstein and Maxwell were guilty. It is by the very nature of their guilt that we KNOW there were LOTS of other people who partook of the forbidden fruit, abusing those children. It is by the nature of the business model of Epstein's enterprise that we KNOW the bulk of those predators were rich and powerful.
So, if the files do NOT produce the evidence we KNOW must exist, including evidence we have already seen, that we will know there is still an ongoing coverup.
Remember Trump has to power to pardon.
True, but even rich people can find themselves unhappy to admit they are pedophiles, which is what accepting a pardon would do. Then there are the state crimes...
Not everyone wants to associate or do business with an admitted pedophile.
They won’t release them.
Not in a format that goes anywhere. Even if dirt comes up, who exactly will prosecute, not Trumps DOJ of Trumps Congress.
Remember Congress passed law to stop Tik Tok and it is still going strong.
This is about power and greed, as I am sure you know. Preaching to the choir. The choreography of the files is for voter morale. The immorality runs deep.
They shud be ashamed for such a blatant lie.
My concern is that trump only started supporting the Epstein files release because he has 2 different ways to avoid releasing them. But he is definitely basking in the glory for releasing them.
The files will be doctored - why else would Trump do a full turnaround.
It's very easy to doctor digital documents.
Crooks and their accomplices do crooked things.
This is going to be the problem with AI. If you can fake everything, evidence as we once knew it like eye witness and document files become meaningless. So we will now have to have 2 trials. One to validate evidence and the other for the real trial. As if our court system were not slow enough now. Perhaps we can then have AI justice to speed up the process.
I'm not getting "terrified". I'm sensing they are sick of this shit, ready to move on, anxious like soldiers with no battle to fight at the moment. But terrified, not really. I think they sense that Trump is no chump--he couldn't go from an all-out war to prevent the release to "Eh that's fine, go for it"--that he must have a few tricks up his sleeve. He always does....